Jean Rice (Interview 4)

Lewis: [00:00:01] Alrighty, good afternoon, sir.
 
Rice: Good evening sis!
 
Lewis: It is November 10th
 
Rice: Yes it is.
 
Lewis: 2017, on a chilly Friday evening. And we are here with Mr. Jean Rice who is going to continue to educate us about Picture the Homeless and the world. How are you feeling?
 
Rice: [00:00:32] Oh! Well, Fall has finally got here. My sister made me some of her coffee, so the chill from outside is gone now. And I'm enjoying this wonderful ambiance that I always [smiles] cherish when I come to my sister's house. It's amazing how much work she does and how she keeps her environment so organized and well maintained. It always reminds me of the stuff I got to do when I go home. [Laughs]
 
Lewis: [00:01:00] Well all right then! [Smiles] So Jean, as the longest member of Picture the Homeless, and now the person who's been there the very longest… There are many, many phrases that you've coined that really served as kind of guideposts for our work. And one of them was “To gain an ally, be an ally.” So, I was wondering if you could talk about what that means?
 
Rice: [00:01:32] Well, first of all, what made me think about that concept, or the idea, was that when you are part of a social justice group like I am with Picture the Homeless, and you need to support of local politicians to get a measure or a policy change, and you go to these politicians, they always approach you with this, “Well have you been politically involved? Have you been an ally? Have you been part of this? So… No because that didn't impact me, or it didn't affect me.”
 
Rice: [00:02:22] And I said, you know what? You can't always wait until it's personal to get involved in the social justice movement. If you want allies in that movement because you know that eventually you're going to need support of more people, you have to be their ally in order to gain their allegiance. It is called, I guess—be proactive instead of reactive. So, that's where the concept came from.
 
Rice: [00:03:00] But, to take it one step further, there are so many issues where there’s commonalities between these groups that Picture the Homeless is involved with, or knows of. Where, their struggle might be on a different front, but it is all leading toward the same objective, which is equality before the law. So, it doesn't matter if you're defending the Immokalee Workers who are involved in agriculture and who are laboring to get their bushels of tomatoes they pick—the amount increased by one penny per bushel. That is related to Domestic Workers United’s struggle to have themselves included in mainstream Americas workforce.
 
Rice: [00:04:03] And then… Well, why is this necessary? We have the National Labor Relations Board. We have all these agencies! So why is it necessary at this time, at this juncture of American history—to focus on Domestic Workers Bill of Rights? And if you think back—1935, Franklin Delano Roosevelt made a compromise, much like Jefferson and them did with the three-fifths compromise—they left agricultural workers and domestic workers out of their New Deal, in order to assure support of southern Democrats to get the New Deal passed into law! So, America's evolution consists of a lot of compromises that a lot of Americans don't like to talk about. But I think when we talk about it, it does two things. It lets us know—the real patriots know—how much work still has to be done but it also lets us know how far we've come.
 
Lewis: [00:05:24] Alright, thank you Jean. Would you share an example of when the Picture the Homeless as an organization—and you personally—were an ally with another group?
 
Rice: [00:05:42] Yeah, well again, our work with Domestic Workers United is dear to me. All of our work is dear to me, but this has a special significance because my grandmother Cora Marshall Rice did domestic work in Anderson, South Carolina for a group of prominent, a family of prominent attorneys, called the Watkins family. And they always gave her the—as the laws changed, they gave them—they gave my grandmother their law books that were no longer relevant and she brought them home. Ironically, my whole family's domestic work was always in the legal community. [Laughs] And somehow... Later in my life, when I'm reading law books, it's like review to me because I learned to read, reading law. [Smiles]
 
Lewis: Wow.
 
Rice: [00:06:49] My grandmother Cora Marshall Rice in Anderson, South Carolina worked for the Watkins family. After migration, my mom [smiles] Elizabeth Sloane Perry Rice, worked for a lawyer by the name of Abraham Kramer, who was predominately a real estate lawyer, but all of these law books found their way to my house and being an only kid, the law books were my companions—that and the radio.
 
Lewis: [00:07:27] Okay. When did you first learn about Domestic Workers United and the fight for the Domestic Worker Bill of Rights in New York State?
 
Rice: [00:07:37] Well I learned about what needed to be done—personally, before I joined Picture the Homeless and before Picture the Homeless introduced me to the group known as Domestic Workers United. Because my mom had looked forward to when she would become eligible for Social Security… And I remember that tragic day in my moms and my life—when I escorted her to the Social Security office, and she was so enthused that now she was going to get her money. And when they informed her that Domestic Workers were not included, so much of the work that she had done didn't have any value as far as going towards Social Security, or that safety net. She was so heartbroken. And that was one of the most sorrowful train rides back from Social Security, back to our house. And she was—more than tears, I mean her spirit was broken.
 
Rice: [00:08:43] It was so devastating to me, but it never occurred to me that I would get a chance to vindicate her all the way from heaven. [Smiles] So, when I got that opportunity that Picture the Homeless gave me to work with Domestic Workers United, I was so enthused, because here was an opportunity for me to vindicate my late mother and also to make sure that no domestic worker would ever be disenfranchised and marginalized like that again.
 
Lewis: [00:09:19] What are some of the things that we as an organization, and you personally did, to show solidarity and be an ally?
 
Rice: Well, [laughs] I remember, two things that stand out in my memory that goes to the subject that we're talking about today. Through the Poverty Scholars program at Union Theological Seminary, I went on a trip to Florida where I met this group called the Immokalee Workers. They were the agricultural component—contemporary—the descendants of the ones that Roosevelt left out of the agricultural side of his New Deal. So, most of them were Hispanic, but they—the commonality between them and the Afros… That between the agricultural workers in the United States and the domestic workers in the United States in 1935, they were over seventy percent of America's work force. So, over seventy percent of the Hispanic and Afro workforce were engaged in agriculture and domestic. Now, I'm not saying seventy percent of the entire labor force of the United States... But seventy percent of the Hispanic and Afro work force was engaged in agriculture and domestic, and those people were left out of Roosevelts' New Deal. It was part of his political strategy. In order to get his New Deal passed, he had to placate Southern politicians by leaving out agricultural and domestic workers.
 
Rice: [00:11:36] So, here's the opportunity that Picture the Homeless gave me to move America forward, toward the realization of their national credo! You cannot have equal economic opportunity when the descendants of that many people are left out of our upward mobility, left out of accumulation, assimilation, acculturation. All of these concepts are meaningless unless these people are given an equal economic footing in our capitalistic society.
 
Lewis: [00:12:24] So what did you… Tell me about that trip, when you went to Florida.
 
Rice: It was amazing. [Smiles] First of all, The Poverty Initiative—the participants are so diverse. I mean, you get a guy like Art Trotman, [smiles] who comes with us on a trip. You get a Liz Theoharis, and you get people who are studying to minister congregations from marginalized, oppressed communities. But they've never experienced marginalization, subjugation, exploitation. So, most of the—most of their philosophy and ideology comes from textbooks and testimony but very few of these sisters and brothers have actual hands-on knowledge about what that looks like.
 
Rice: [00:13:29] So, when we get to meet the Immokalee Workers—and first there's an educational component. “We want you to know”… I'm paraphrasing the Immokalee Workers, “these tomatoes that we pick, have you ever thought, when you enjoy your pizza from the Pizza Hut, have you ever thought about how much exploitation you're digesting—what went into that? Well, we're the ones that got those tomatoes to your table and here's where our living conditions are.” So that kind of makes you a inadvertent participant in their exploitation! And while you’re unaware, our Creator doesn't expect you to do anything about it. But, once you become aware, you have a commitment, an internal commitment, to do something progressive to change that… Unequal, unjust process or situation.
 
Lewis: [00:14:44] And so… Did anybody else from Picture the Homeless go on that trip?
 
Rice: Yes. Sister Arvernetta Henry, who’s also a Poverty Scholar, Brother Owen Rogers, also a Poverty Scholar. The three of us always represent Picture the Homeless in the Poverty Scholars program at Union Theological Seminary because we realize that in order to gain allies and build a mobilization, it's essential that we have members of the faith-based community. So through the Poverty Scholars Program at Union Theological Seminary—is a major component in Picture the Homeless building an alliance with the faith-based community.
 
Lewis: [00:15:37] So, when you went to Florida, you got some political education from the Immokalee Workers, and then what happened?
 
Rice: And then they bought it—they brought the struggle north after we returned and we followed the tomato trail [laughs] —not the money trail, the tomato trail. While we're in Florida, we focused our action against Fibers—or one of these companies that bought up all the tomatoes in bulk. The demand was one penny more per bushel, for tomatoes picked. And then they brought it north to the retail level. Wholesale was Fibrous—or some group that bought in bulk, and that was the struggle down there. And then we came here, and we started to mobilize in places like Taco Bell, Pizza Hut. But the thing was that, in the end the Immokalee Workers got their penny! [Smiles]
 
Lewis: Were there any actions that you guys
 
Rice: Yes.
 
Lewis: participated in, in Florida?
 
Rice: [00:16:49] Yeah, against this Fibrous—this group. I'm sure through the Poverty Initiative we could determine the actual name—I think something with an F—Fibrous or something comes to my mind. But we concentrated on them in Florida, and then like I said, after they bought wholesale, en mass, they as distributors sold in lesser quantity to outlets like Taco Bell, Pizza Hut et cetera, et cetera. So, our northern campaign focused on the finished product—how these tomatoes that were the product of subjugation and marginalization, how—and exploitation—how these products went into the foodstuff that we consumed as consumers, at the retail level here in New York City. And it was an excellent example, because now we were encouraging people, “Don't buy into this.” It's much like the campaign now against the anti-union forces in Colombia, South America, that encourage you not to buy Coca-Cola as long as Coca-Cola continues to do business with the non-union oppressive element in Colombia, South America—it's similar.
 
Lewis: [00:18:17] So, let's loop back to Domestic Workers United. So, what are some of the ways that you participated in that campaign to win the Domestic Workers Bill of Rights?
 
Rice: Well again, [smiles] I have to comment on the motivation that my organization Picture the Homeless gave me. Because Domestic Workers United’s focus was not at the local level where you just get up at one locality in New York City and go to City Hall and stay on the steps a half hour. It's a little harder than that. Because when State legislators are the target of your action… When they are the ones, the objects of your demand… Going to Albany—if you’re in New York City, you have to get on a bus by six a.m. in order to get to Albany at the beginning of the Albany legislative day. You have to schedule audiences with these targeted State legislators in advance.
 
Rice: [00:19:43] And it's hard when you're part of a homeless led, homeless directed group, to plan that far ahead. To make sure that when you are given a slot, you fulfill it. Because only members of Picture the Homeless know how hard it has been to gain access to the policy makers. And some of the excuses, when we first started to try to get access was, “Well, we talk for you because you're a homeless group, we never know where you are—bah-bah-bah-bah-bah.” So, in order—in keeping with our motto, “Don't Talk About Us, Talk To Us!”, we have to make sure that when we're given access that we are present at the designated time, at the designated place, with the designated message, in order to have a shot at gaining the designated objective.

Lewis: [00:20:52] Mm-hmmm. And you went several times to Albany

Rice: [Laughing] Yes.

Lewis: to lobby for that bill.
 
Rice: Never missed the bus. [Smiles]
 
Lewis: [00:21:00] What was it like on the bus? Tell me a story about one of those bus rides.
 
Rice: Well… [Laughs] Some of the dynamic sisters—and there were many. But one sister comes to my mind because she shares the last name of my director—Miss Christine Lewis... Such a dynamic sister, and one of the leaders of Domestic Workers United. She would give a talk and one of her assistants would start in the front of the bus, to the back—and give out hand-outs.
 
Lewis: Mm-hmmm.
 
Rice: And on these handouts we would see our name—the name of the people on the bus. And Domestic Workers United had already assigned us certain slots with certain state legislators. And I would be amazed to look and see how many times my name was on that darn list to meet with so many legislators!
 
Rice: [00:22:02] So, after we did the introductions and the go around, I would find myself getting to sister Christine Lewis, and I would say, “Sis, why is my name down here so many times?” She always had the same response, “Because your story is authentic and touching. But Jean, you have to tell that same story to as many of the people that we need to vote as possible… About your mom being a domestic worker that was excluded… About that terrible day when your mother found out that she had been excluded and had no Social Security coming… And what it was like on that train ride—and that is why you are here today, the reason why. I think everybody that we need to vote needs to hear that story.”
 
Rice: [00:22:58] So, then the burden didn't seem so heavy. I went to the back of the bus and practiced the relevant parts of that presentation and looked up to heaven and I felt my mother smiling down [smiles] and saying, “Yeah, I feel halfway vindicated right now.”
 
Lewis: [00:23:18] And then, when you would come back from Albany, I remember you bringing packets back to the office. So, how did the skills that you gained on those trips come back to Picture the Homeless? How did that happen?
 
Rice: Because prior to going to Albany with Domestic Workers United, I had went to Albany before with a sister group, Community Voices Heard on a different issue, involving the decriminalization of marijuana. So, I had already learned the value of interaction with state legislators. Always get their contact information. Always ask what standing committee they are part of. Bring that back to my organization. Put it in our database.
 
Rice: [00:24:12] Because as the struggle for social equality and social justice evolves, Picture the Homeless might need to call on these legislators in the future to interact with us in a progressive manner about our legislation or policy changes—where Picture the Homeless was the leader, not Community Voices or Domestic Workers United. So, I had learned from that process to always, whenever possible, to retain that contact information and bring it back to my organization.
 
Rice: [00:24:49] And it's been productive. For instance, it was during that kind of interaction that I met two Brooklyn grassroots legislators that were then part of the state legislature, Hakeem Jefferies and.. What's the other one’s name? [Laughs], I forgot right now, but there's two of them. And they were part of our decriminalization efforts at the state level. So, that for quality-of-life crimes—or quality of life accusations, people wouldn't be put through the criminal justice process, but just given a ticket. So, one of them, is now the Borough President of Brooklyn…
 
Lewis: Eric Adams?
 
Rice: [00:25:52] Eric Adams and Hakeem Jeffries! Now Hakeem Jeffries went to Washington as a Congress person. But initially, through Picture the Homeless, I had a relationship with them when they were State legislators in Albany. So, if I want our representative in Washington to get a Picture the Homeless message to the Black Caucus all I need to do is to draft something credible and send it to him, and I already have this relationship with him, and the Borough President of Brooklyn. All of this—my interaction with them came through assignments that Picture the Homeless gave me and my interaction with sister groups—part of our permanent coalition.
 
Lewis: Thank you. Could you describe how those experiences lobbying for legislation in support of another group, Domestic Workers United helped us as part of the Communities United for Police Reform Coalition when we were lobbying for the Community Safety Act?
 
Rice: [00:27:15] Its because of a—part of a speech that Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. wrote. I don't know if it’s written or verbal… But any way, whether it came from his pen or from his lips, Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. said, “An injustice anywhere, is a threat to justice everywhere.” So, he did this before we were talking about globalization, and… But the concept is profound.
 
Rice: [00:27:53] Because even though Immokalee Workers are being exploited while they pick tomatoes, domestic workers are being exploited while they help maintain and stabilize households of another class of people—often letting—sacrificing, stabilizing, and helping their own household. Oftentimes these nannies are spending time with their employer's children, more often than spending time with their own children. So, somehow all of these struggles are interconnected.
 
Rice: [00:28:43] It's sort of like after the passage of the Public Accommodations bill. So now you get the right to sit at the lunch counter, to order the food. But if you are a pauper, if you are destitute, if you have no money and you can't pay for that cup of coffee and that slice of pie—what good is the right to sit at the counter?  
 
Rice: [00:29:12] So, again. Dr. Martin Luther King Jr., [smiles] one of my heroes, he wrote this book, Where Do We Go from Here? And, in that book he lets us know how important it is that we move from Public Accommodations to Economic Justice. And that's where we are right now. While females that's part of the workforce, doing the same work are not getting the same pay, that's not economic justice. When CEO's of Fortune 500 companies are making over three hundred—three hundred—three hundred times the amount as a rank-and-file worker... We need to think about that. How could one Homo Sapien be three hundred times worth more than the rank-and-file person? There's something wrong with that equation.
 
Rice: [00:30:24] So I'm still blessed to have the five senses that my Creator gave me, and I can move around a lot. As I go around New York City doing the work of Picture the Homeless and doing my own personal, survival work—a lot of fellow and sister New Yorkers, I have to show them my ID. They don't want to believe that this Homo Sapien is seventy-eight years old. But that's because—I guess, when the mind stays alive, it keeps the body alive. And when you have a purpose to fulfill and when you are active and you're using all of those skills instead of them growing dull, they become heightened. And I think that's a big part of my survival, is staying active and keep using the facilities, the mental and physical.
 
Lewis: [00:31:26] You mentioned the term survival work. Could you describe what a day in the life of Jean on his survival work [pauses] looks like.
 
Rice: Well typically, I get out of my bed when Steve Harvey goes off, which is ten a.m. in the morning. Coincidentally that's the time that my office on 126th Street opens, between nine-thirty and ten a.m. So, in case whoever is going to open our office—because they do round table, the same person doesn't open every day. But I know when I'm making my coffee, while I get in the shower that somebody is opening up my office. So typically, I start my day off with that.
 
Rice: [00:32:22] I get out the shower and have my morning—my first cup of coffee, I make my way to the BX35 bus which is a block, one block, from Webster House where I live at currently—transitional housing. And I take the BX35 down to River Avenue where I get the four train to 125th Street, which is right around the corner from my office. So usually, I'm in my office between eleven and twelve, twelve-thirty—around lunchtime, I get to my office at Picture the Homeless. I usually try to get out of the office around lunchtime. I mean around rush hour time. I get there at lunchtime.
 
Rice: [00:33:10] I try to give it four hours, but by five o'clock, I try to be on forty-second street and Vanderbilt Avenue where I do public solicitation. And I get so insulted when somebody calls my public solicitation panhandling. Just yesterday, the Salvation Army started their public solicitation campaign right across the street on Vanderbilt Avenue from where I do my public solicitation! And no law enforcement agent approached that Salvation Army person, with their tripod out with the bucket and ringing the bell… Nobody called them a panhandler! Nobody questioned their right to be on a public sidewalk.
 
Rice: [00:34:07] So, because Picture the Homeless is opposed to stereotypes… What I do, is take up a post right next to—right across the street from that Salvation Army person that's going to be there throughout the holidays. They're there every year! And when a police officer comes up to me and says, “Why are you panhandling here?” I usually say, “Officer, with all due respect, I am not a panhandler. I am a public solicitor and I'm doing the exact same thing that that person across the street is doing. So why are you profiling me and stereotyping me?” And it usually works to the point that now the police don't even bother me anymore. [Smiles] And yesterday was the first day… It is interesting to see out this holiday season is going to play out.
 
Lewis: [00:35:00] And you've been doing that kind of work for how many years?
 
Rice: Oh, over a decade. And that's what I call survival. A lot of my fellow New Yorkers call that part of the underground economy. And part of that is ecological engineering, which is picking up recyclable containers and public solicitation. A lot of so called homeless/undomiciled New Yorkers, help to distribute AM New York newspapers, et cetera. So contrary to public opinion, there are a lot of working New Yorkers that can't afford market rent, that are undomiciled. Not because they are lazy, it's just because the wages have not kept up with cost.
 
Lewis: [00:36:06] So you mention a lot of undomiciled, homeless folks are also working, and you had mentioned also, the challenges for folks who are homeless just being politically active. Could you tell me about a time when you were homeless that you had to be somewhere at a certain time and how that—that's kind of different if you have a place to live versus sleeping on a train or sleeping outside?
 
Rice: [00:36:41] Yeah, because again, one of the most challenging times—one of the most challenging times, is when we have to be in Albany. That always requires being somewhere—stabilized, prepared, at six a.m. in the morning. So, automatically that tells me that my survival tactics the night before cannot be picking up recyclable containers when restaurants close at approximately ten and I'm engaged until like two a.m., picking up.
 
Rice: [00:37:25] Because in the first place where am I… What am I going to do with the containers that I picked up? Second of all, I haven't gotten enough rest. So, if I got to be in Albany the next day, automatically that's a public solicitation night—where I can go to 42nd Street and Vanderbilt, work the rush hour, and then—even if I'm undomiciled—I'm finished, with money in my pocket, at approximately ten o'clock p.m. So I can find a secluded spot if I'm undomiciled and get some rest. But then—I might tend to oversleep.
 
Rice: [00:38:10] So, I am so privileged to be in transitional housing at Webster House, where I can tell security, when I come in, “Can I have a wake up at such and such a time?” And they'll have somebody to knock on my door… In case my internal—in my apartment, in my little room—my internal alarm doesn't go—doesn't go off, et cetera. It’s a safeguard.
 
Rice: [00:38:39] But it's so important if you're going to Albany, that you be on time. It is so important, that if Picture the Homeless has secured financial support for you to take a flight to go somewhere else in the country to represent Picture the Homeless, to show that poverty in the eastern part of the United States is somehow connected to poverty in Appalachia, or the West Coast, et cetera.
 
Rice: [00:39:16] So again, for a undomiciled/homeless person to have to be that time conscious, it’s part of your inner self discipline, that you really need, if you try to assimilate from the bottom of the grassroots into mainstream economic America. People need to depend on you, and in order for them to be able to depend on you, you have to be dependable. In order to be dependable, you have to be punctual. It all connects!
 
Rice: [00:39:51] But when you are street homeless/undomiciled you don't need that type of discipline, so you tend not to practice it. So you institutionalize internally this unpunctual behavior. When you're picking out recyclable containers at a ballgame, part of the job is drinking all the beer that's left over when people go into the ball game. But when you have to cash in those recyclable containers at eight a.m. in the morning and meet your group at Picture the Homeless to talk to members of the City Council—you can't be hung over and you can't drink all that beer. And again, if you enjoy transitional housing, you can put them containers of beer [smiles] in your refrigerator. Or you could buy you a small cooler and some ice and put it away and you look forward to after you do the business—coming back to your transitional housing spot and enjoying that pleasure.
 
Rice: [00:41:03] So being involved with Picture the Homeless, it's not only what you do for your allies. It's not only what you contribute to the society at large. Part of that self-development, that inner discipline—how to be punctual, how to be reliable, that is going to be such a valuable asset in your private life, when you are no longer part of Picture the Homeless, or as you evolve.
 
Rice: [00:41:35] There are two members of my organization that impress me—new members. One is named Al, and his partner, Charmel. Often, when I am on my post, doing my survival stint at Vanderbilt and 42nd, sister Charmel comes by. Part of her survival thing is [being] a messenger. So aside from Picture the Homeless finding her a responsible, accountable person, there are people who have messages to distribute, who trust sister Charmel to deliver that message on foot! And I know she does it because she passes me and says hello as she's doing it. And she's been doing it long enough that I know that she's dependent and reliable, because if she wasn't they would have fired her a long time ago!  
 
Rice: [00:42:32] So, for that reason, she's one of the many members of Picture the Homeless, new, and upcoming, that I continue to try to lend my support to, because I know already, trying to help someone that's not trying to help themselves is an exercise in futility. But I stay at Picture the Homeless in case another sister Charmel might need my assistance or my experience as they try to pursue upward mobility.
 
Lewis: [00:43:09] Do you remember—could you tell me a time where folks slept over in the office so they could be prepared to go out of town the next day, because they had no place where they could stay that night before?
 
Rice: Ummm. There are several times. I'm trying to think about which time [pauses] and I think—I think that when we mobilized to go to either the first or the second United States Social Forum—not to be confused with the World Social Forum… But this United States Social Forum took place in Atlanta, Georgia. And it was around my birthday, around July, it was in the summer. I forgot what year.
 
Rice: [00:44:15] But a lot of the people that went with us… We took a huge delegation from Picture the Homeless. Some were in transitional housing, some were street homeless—a very diverse group, and some staff. But in order for all those components to come together, we had to have a place where we all met and then went to take part in this trip. That was one of the times when I was proud of Picture the Homeless’s ability to organize and mobilize… Because again, from different facets and different stations in our citizenry in New York City, we had staff members who had already went through homelessness and now were housed. We had people within transitional housing, such as Bruce Little and his partner Torrie. They were housed in some transitional unit right off Central Park North.
 
Rice: [00:45:33] And… But all of us came together because what we wanted to do was to show the diversity of the homeless population—and that it wasn't a lack of effort. It was policy deficits that caused so many New Yorkers to be unhoused, and it became part of a national epidemic. Why is it that the wealthiest country in the world cannot deal with housing its population? And historically, you can't just say that population increases, because America has long experienced population increases, but never since depression time have we had so many American undomiciled.
 
Rice: [00:46:44] So when you do the research, the housing crisis started in the eighties. So prior to the eighties we had unemployment problems, but the unemployed had housing. Prior to the eighties, we had substance abuse problems, but the substance abusers had housing. So, there's something far more profound, not as simplistic as substance abuse, not as simplistic as dysfunctional families. There's something at the crux, at the root of why—even as we devote more taxpayer dollars to the homeless situation, homelessness continues to escalate.
 
Rice: [00:47:44] You can't say, “Well put more money there, the problem with diminish…” Something… More money, more homeless... Something is wrong at the policy making level. Something is wrong when Congress delegates money from the national budget for a shelter system that does not produce permanent housing, does not produce stability. Why does so much money go to maintain a failing shelter system and so little money is being delegated or earmarked, for permanent housing?  
 
Rice: [00:48:27] So that's where—I guess in the future, Picture the Homeless is going to have to call on Congressional members that started out being allies in Albany, to give us an answer to these problems. Why is your Congress that you're a part of, continuing to delegate, with your vote, so much money toward a failed shelter system and so little money for providing permanent shelter for those—especially those at the bottom of the socio-economic strata?
 
Rice: [00:48:59] Who is at the bottom? People on fixed income—Social Security checks, pension funds, do not, do not, balance the capital market, capitalistic market for affordable housing! When you give landlords the right to do superficial make up—new paint, new… And then up the rent by a certain percentile but people's Social Security check doesn't go up by that same percentile… When the cost of transportation goes up and you want to go on business that is not subsidized by three metro cards. The cost-of-living increase that you get from Social Security or from your pension doesn't cover that.
 
Rice: [00:49:59] So, as long as I'm on the Board at Picture the Homeless, as long as I get a voice, I'm going to remember the Biblical admonishment that came from Christ, that said, “That which you do for the least amongst you, consider you did it unto me.” And right now, in our American strata for citizenry—pensioneers, people that get Social Security checks—these people on fixed income are the economically least amongst us.
 
Rice: [00:50:35] So if we go back to the equation that I live under every day—that no matter what the market says, I'm not obligated to pay no more than one third of my check for rent. To me that should be a universal concept, if not universal it should certainly be national, because it comes from a HUD standard. So I'd like to ask our representatives in Congress how did we get away from the HUD standard that emanated in Washington? To the point where now in New York, a lot of these people on fixed income are required to pay fifty percent, sixty percent of their check for rent, and it leaves so little for the other necessities in life. And this is why Picture the Homeless is going to have to lead again to shift this struggle, after this election period, to Washington, to ask our Congressional delegation how do we get away from that national standard that HUD implemented in Washington to now where so many that can't afford it are required to pay so much?
 
Lewis: [00:51:47] Thank you Jean. You brought up being on the Board of Picture the Homeless. Would you mind describing what it was like back in the day, when we formed the Board? And what existed before the Board?
 
Rice: Well. [Laughs] It's really funny.
 
Lewis: And why is it funny? [Smiles]
 
Rice: The flashback, yeah, the flashback… Because the board evolved from what we had as a Steering Committee. I remember we got a dynamic duo—Stephen Bradley is still with us. He serves on… He worked with Picture the Homeless—with Communities United… No, Community Voices Heard. Stephen was working with them, Community Voices Heard, but he’s sort of my board mentor who taught me how to be more professional and how important the board responsibility was.
 
Rice: [00:52:59] And he, at the time—he had a partner, named Larry, who used to sing with this R&B group called the Chords. And I remember when I was in high school, The Chord's theme song was one of my favorite songs, called Sha-Boom. It's been covered by a lot of other groups now. But anyway, Larry and Steve were part of our Steering Committee, getting back to the question. And while they were part of our Steering Committee, they helped us to just go through our—extrapolate our surveys to categories where they had common themes.
 
Rice: [00:53:45] They helped us with financials… So, all of a sudden… And at this time Judson Memorial Church was our financial sponsors. It's really hard to be homeless led, homeless directed while another entity is exercising the financial component that Judson Memorial was good enough to do as our financial sponsor.
 
Rice: [00:54:15] So, during a discussion of our Steering Committee, we decided it would be in the best interest of Picture the Homeless—considering our evolution, planned strategy and where our vision of where the group will go—we should become a non-profit entity unto its own. We should go to Albany and apply for status as a non-profit corporation. To do that, we needed a Board! And as part of the Steering Committee we had a meeting and we had to elect at least three people, for three board requirements. We had to have a chair person, a treasurer, and a secretary.
 
Rice: [00:55:10] So, as part of a Steering Committee, I sat in on that meeting and we came up with two people and we needed one more. And I nominated this person that no longer comes to Picture the Homeless meetings, Mr. John Rhodes. And the whole Steering Committee looked at me like I committed a travesty. [Laughs]And then, I said, “Well, if not John Rhodes, who?!” And they said, “You!” [Laughs] I became the first secretary of Picture the Homeless in its non-profit position with the State of New York. I ain’t never been a secretary of nothing before in my life and I had no idea what being a secretary entailed, what my responsibilities were, what my duties were—no idea. But evidently the other members of the Steering Committee thought that I could learn on the job. So that's how I became a founding member [smiles] of the Board of Directors of Picture the Homeless. For the record, I did not lobby for the position. I did not volunteer for the position. I got drafted by our Steering Committee. [Laughs]
 
Lewis: [00:56:36] You’re one of the few people that is with Picture the Homeless—that was with Picture the Homeless when we were at Judson. Could you describe what the office was like at Judson?
 
Rice: Well, let's start [smiles] with the physical description. The space was so small that our former office is now an elevator shaft. So, you can imagine the dimensions. However, it was located below the ground level, southwest 4th Street Park… The drainage—horrible. And when we had a rain—a downpour over normal… Water would pour through our one window. And we would be so occupied with picking all of our paperwork up to make sure nothing got damaged. So, [laughs] my sister Lynn, our proud director—her working space was so close to that window, that often she would help us pick up the paperwork so it wouldn't get wet, and she would sit back down in her chair—and her chair would be wet. And I always used to tease her and say, “It looks like you urinated on yourself!” And she didn't like that joke. [Smiles]
 
Rice: [00:58:15] But that’s just to show one of the inconveniences. And that, instead of being concerned about our personal… The clothing we were wearing getting wet or whatever, our first concern was that vital paperwork. And then when we had general meetings and we expected over a dozen people, we would move—with Judson Churches permission—we would convene our meeting in the Judson Memorial Church gymnasium, which is where the first meeting that I attended.. Our general meetings were usually held in the gym at Judson Memorial Church. That's where I got drafted for our Civil Rights committee.
 
Rice: [00:59:05] So, every… As we sit here nearing Thanksgiving, we're already preparing for our December, Longest Night commemoration… Because we always return to Judson Memorial Church on the Longest Night of the Year to commemorate those undomiciled New Yorkers who have passed on during the last twelve months.
 
Rice: [00:59:46] So when we do that, I can't help but reflect on our humble beginnings which makes me appreciate how my organization has evolved. And it always brings warmth to my heart and a smile to my face to think that I've been part of that evolution and that Picture the Homeless is still going strong.
 
Rice: [01:00:20] And that we have a lot of more work to do. But we have a lot more assets, and I don't just mean financial. But we have name recognition. We have allies—globally… These are assets. We have assets in human resources. We have social capital. How do we transform that to make a difference in the struggle for global economic and social justice? And I guess that's part of what keeps me alive. Every day that I wake up, after I prioritize about life sustaining assets—what I need for that day, to get through that day, my second agenda item is, how can I contribute to make social and economic justice a global reality?
 
Lewis: [01:01:28] Alright Jean, do you have anything that you would like to add to this session today?
 
Rice: [01:01:35] I just want the audience to know that part of the reason that I continue to come to these interviews is because I've become addicted to my sister's homemade cookies. [Laughs]
 
Lewis: Well, thank you for that profound reflection. [Smiles]
 
Rice: [Laughs] I don't know what you're going to do with the stuff—doing this with you is so much fun! Here take this stuff off of me! [Laughs]
 
Lewis: Alright.